ADSL Solutions Geared for Gamers

[spAc3dd]

Hi Guys,

I need to pick your brains regarding the above.

What would YOU like in an aDSL package from your service provider? I have some ideas like:

1.) If you play online after a specific time (Sorta like callmore time...) the bandwidth you use will not count towards your cap.

2.) High-speed aDSL via fibre (as opposed to satellite) for gamers.

3.) Allowing that authentication traffic through even when your international cap is finished so that you can still play on LOCAL servers. (remember that you still have 30Gb local cap left after using you international cap)

Feedback, please? Any other ideas?

I would really appreciate your input as I am currently looking at developing some kind of solution that caters to the Gaming market for AWESOME pricing.

[FeralBanana]

Sounds hectic but just a question about no 3): Does that mean when we're internationally capped we can still play 2142 somehow on the SGS servers? And even if you're not will playing on 2142 SGS servers take away from the 30gig local or the X gig int?

[stoke]

If it's really geared for gamers then you've got to look at the support services:

04.) Managed TeamSpeak server available for use.
05.) Clan website hosting environment.
06.) Game purchasing Website with bulk-order discounts.
07.) Game Admins and a proper complaint channel - paid admins - LOL.
08.) Leagues and Competitions.
09.) Resumable FTP Site (or HTTP) to download games and game demo's from.
10.) Provision for a newsletter across this entire community to which community members can contribute.
11.) E-Mail address which can forward to member's real e-mail addres.
12.) Provision for a LAN environment.

All local usage must NOT chew your international cap. Yup .. this one is impossible for now.

And .. why the 30GB cap on local? Seriously? WHY?

[spAc3dd]

@Feral:

Yep, that is EXACTLY what it means....

Your LOGIN to the EA servers is obviously International traffic and minimal, but the actual game play that uses the bandwidth so quickly is local, so you should be able to play without much International traffic at all....

As for Stokey's suggestions:

04.) This is already installed and as a small POC and will be available in the FINAL gaming offering to our Gamers.
05.) This is also in the pipeline...
06.) Selling games is not our business, but we might look at getting in selected vendors to do this through our website.
07.) There will be proper complaint channels 24/7/365. There will be a dedicated support team available.
08.) This will definitely be happening. We have already approached various hardware and software vendors as partners in this.
09.) Yep this will be available as well in our final offering.
10.) That is an excellent idea and definitely bears deeper consideration.
11.) We will be looking at this as well.
12.) Please can you expand on this point?

The local usage adding towards you international cap is unfortunately a reality right now, but will be remedied in the future.

30Gb Local Cap? What is considered LOCAL traffic? Within SA? Do myou know that we get charged R 6000 per 64Kb of traffic that travels from our Rosebank POP to our Cape Town POP? So for us, LOCAL bandwidth within SA borders is NOT free...

[JAWS_Firefox]

And talking about support...
Some seriously stringent SLA's on repairs if the ADSL goes down.
Or even better, provide a free wireless alternative for essentials like downloading e-mails and logging on to WarGeeks to inform ppl of you dilema, even if it is at a slower, non-gaming level.

[Pios]

I think the idea ADSL solution should be in the realms of:
1. Unlimited
2. Unshapped
3. Reasonably priced.
4. Consistantly low pings.

That would sort things out. propper.

[stoke]

12.) Um .. meant that the league game finals will have to be lan based, to eliminate lag from the equation, but I dunno how this is supposed to happen, cos it's going to have to be provincial in the semi-fianls, and then you'll have to relocate peeps for the finals, and it is part of the whole money thing.

I wanted to add : Peeps who are using routers for their connection will have to re-configure their routers to use the gaming connection, so perhaps some easy auto-router config software would be useful.

[rainy]

I agree with Pios. The cap must go. Caps like ours for prices like ours are sub-substandard, compared internationally.

[spAc3dd]

Internationally, they don't have a telco monopoly ripping everyone off...

[rainy]

Most of the European countries used to have a telco monopoly as well. The question is, who besides the user has a vital interest in breaking that monopoly?

[stoke]

Stick to the topoic please ... i don't think Spaced has much control over teklom.

[Askari]

Have you approached Neotel as a partner or will you be getting BW from Telkom?

[spAc3dd]

I will be getting bandwidth from Internet Solutions as it is an IS initiative. We want to provide free gaming services to the SA community and we are looking into providing tailor-made consumer aDSL solutions specifically designed with the gamer in mind.

Honestly, there is nothing worse than lag except one thing - your bandwidth running out. We are even looking into routing our gaming dsl solution over fiber as opposed to our standard dsl solution that get's routed via satellite.

So, in essence, we are looking at cheap, low latency, dependable dsl with SUPPORT ppl to fall back on if anything goes wrong. Yes, this includes support for the gaming servers hosted at IS. We want to get back to gamers on support issues in a ABSOLUTE MAXIMUM TIME of 48 hours. No 2 weeks crap.

[Askari]

Ja cos you know how bad latency is supposed to be with IS.

Spacey, I applaud your efforts. However its beyond me why there should even be a Gaming DSL package. All DSL packages should be of the highest quality available: Low latency, low pings, fewest hops, realistic pricing, unshaped etc etc etc. Its only the Telkom mindset that has invented these issues in an effort to milk the consumer.

[SlappY]

I gotta agree with the Chicken Doc on this one.
You should sell it as "What ADSL SHOULD be"

[Askari]

You know im right!

[Bass]

At the end of the day gamers want the lowest ping possible (would really be great to have that to overseas servers, so we can actually play there without being kicked - get a few non-SA dogtags :D), so that would have to be the first thing to concentrate on. The only other way to get gamers interested is on price.

On a related note, your test server seems to have handled very well so far, which is another obvious drawcard ....

[spAc3dd]

Ja cos you know how bad latency is supposed to be with IS.

Spacey, I applaud your efforts. However its beyond me why there should even be a Gaming DSL package. All DSL packages should be of the highest quality available: Low latency, low pings, fewest hops, realistic pricing, unshaped etc etc etc. Its only the Telkom mindset that has invented these issues in an effort to milk the consumer.

I must differ with a couple of things that you mentioned here...

Why a GAMER DSL package? I'll tell you why... There are business packages available that cost in the region of about R 2000 a month. For this you get 5 Static IPs and a managed router and 512Kb UNCAPPED. I doubt many gamers can afford that. Secondly, I would wager that gamers are by FAR the biggest bandwidth gobblers when compared to your normal schmo on the street who can get away with 500Mb a month most times. How long does a 3Gb cap last you? I'll wager until sometime in the 2nd week of the month. Then you need to buy a 3Gb upgrade that'll hopefully last until the end of the month, but most likely not, forcing you to buy a even MORE bandwidth. The solution we are going to offer will remedy this situation in a cost-effective way. You won't NEED to cough up over and over again...

I think it a bit unfair to say that it is a 'Telkom mindset' that has created this to milk the consumer. It would be more accurate to say that it is Telkom THEMSELVES doing this? Did you read my earlier post in this thread regarding LOCAL and INTERNATIONAL bandwidth? What the consumer sees as LOCAL (ie within South Africa) is by far not LOCAL for IS. Our buddies Telkom charge us R 6000 for every 64k that travels from our Rosebank IDC to our Cape Town IDC. Who is milking the consumer now? Have you EVER heard of such prices?!

Just bear in mind that we are a business and not a charity. We are going to come up with a cost-effective, reliable and FAST, low latency solution DESPITE the fact that we get ripped off by Telkom so badly! Have you got any idea how those bastards (Telkom) operate? We deal with their shitty attitudes on a daily basis. They are obstructive to anyone they see as competition. And I am not talking about healthy competition here, but sabotage and spite.

Not only do they rip the consumer off... It seems that they even rip their own staff off. How many people have the idiots retrenched since 2000? I was told by an ex-employee that the figures are around 14000. They couldn't deliver a decent service WITH those employees, how the hell do they think they're gonna deliver a good service with less people?

ANYWAY I ramble. I get worked up when I hear the T word...

As for the high latency that you heard of... Was that perchance from a Telkom or Verizon employee? I have DSL through IS and I can tell you that when other gamers are moaning that they're lagging on the BF2 or 2142 servers, that I am usually am not.

So :p to you...

The only thing I agree with you about is the idea that Telkom is milking the consumer. What I don't agree with is that you imply that IS have the same mindset. We cannot have that mindset, as we do not sell to the consumer at this stage, but only corporates. The Gaming DSL thing will be our first attempt at selling consumer products since th Icon days. And I can tell you that all the packages will be reasonably priced while providing excellent service.

[TG]

I, for one, am looking forward to seeing what you guys come up with.

[SlappY]

Yeah, either way it sounds like it is going to be good

[Askari]

Spaced, I apologise if it came across that I was lumping IS in the same cesspool as Telkom. Like you however state, Telkom's effect is far reaching.

Sure you are going to have different packages for different types of users. But often this means that DSL in its pure form is restricted. Shaping is something that someone does to the service to restrict it, doesnt cost anymore to unshape it,it comes unshaped. Yet we are sold unshaped packages at a premium price.

What we would like to see is a pure DSL service with reasonable bandwidth charges. We dont need 5 IPs, we dont need T1 lines, we want unshaped, <1Mbps, <10gigs, SLA's, 24/7 support, low pings, low latency and all that at R500 per month.

[Bass]

Maybe a silly question here, but do/can IS not have their own backbone linking major centres - then you'll only need the international access through telkom - or would that then fall into the telco operator realm .. ??

[spAc3dd]

Maybe a silly question here, but do/can IS not have their own backbone linking major centres - then you'll only need the international access through telkom - or would that then fall into the telco operator realm .. ??

This sounds like a good idea and sure, around Jo,burg, Cape Town and Pretoria, we HAVE our own Wrieless links between our centre's WITHIN these towns, but the comms between these towns still go through the Hellkom infrastructure as they provide the only service at this time...

[spAc3dd]

Hey Guys...

We are starting testing on fibre (as opposed to current Satellite) DSL solutions for CONSUMERS soon. This might also include prioritized traffing for things like STEAM, BattleNet, BF Services. We are trying to find ways of giving less latency at an affordable price. I'll give you more on this soon.

Thanks for the feedback you gave me, I really appreciate your input. I especially found askari's views refreshing...

[TG]

Well, if you want any gamers to do some testing for you, you know where (and who) to ask. ;)

[Askari]

Thanks for the feedback you gave me, I really appreciate your input. I especially found askari's views refreshing...

I dont think ive ever given anyone a refreshing view before? Woot!

[Bass]

:rofl:

Sounds great spAc3dd !!! Waiting with much anticipation .... :)

[sss]

dont forget xbox live customers

[gus]

Hey Guys...

We are starting testing on fibre (as opposed to current Satellite) DSL solutions for CONSUMERS soon. This might also include prioritized traffing for things like STEAM, BattleNet, BF Services. We are trying to find ways of giving less latency at an affordable price. I'll give you more on this soon.

Thanks for the feedback you gave me, I really appreciate your input. I especially found askari's views refreshing...

Please keep us posted. I would be very interested in an international connection with low latency, both for work and for play. (Currently using an unshaped account.)

[Bullzeye]

hi, is there an eta on this service, or is it too early to tell? Ive been looking for an IS solution for ages now and this would be perfect

[varkai]

umm correct me if i'm wrong but wasn't telkom suposed to at one stage offer unlimited local usage

[Roloreaper]

"Supose to" in Telkom terms is equal to "We would like to but it will lower our profits"

[Tyrin]

Well one question that has been bugging me for ages, now I have travelled a lot and I must say we are very fortunate in this country given our Surroundings.
I have been to most of the African countries on this continent (I was forced!!) and I must say that we as south Africans are spoilt. However we do have world class technology when it comes to IT. My question is how come we are the only African country to have limits on our internet access? how come we are limited to X amount of bandwidth? is telkoms infrastructure not capable of handling the load? I have a local account only .. I.e no international, which is unlimited and I must say it is a fast as a lambo with NOS! However when I go international it slows down to about a horse drawn cart. Does telkom not have enough international bandwidth as I see this as being the problem. Their profits speak for themselves, do something valuable with your money!!!!!! okay okay I know I'm b*tching and getting nowhere .. but I really feel that they have the ability, just darn lazy!!!!!

Okay maybe a few questions after all :confused:

[gus]

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monopoly
AKA Telkom can only make that big profit if they sell only part of their capacity at a higher price. By limiting capacity, they make us desperate enough to pay the higher price, thus make more money.

[Tyrin]

it's really sad, but one thing I found intresting from the site GKM,

* fagget

A pure monopoly is an industry in which a single firm is the sole producer of a good or the sole provider of a service. This is usually caused by barriers to entry.


:rofl: confirmed! :rofl:

[Scarlock]

I have been told that Hellkom deliberatly slows traffic to and from the landing station in Melkboss. i.e. when entering or exiting their SAT3 cable.
Try a pingpath, and see for yourself.... its scary

[gus]

I have been told that Hellkom deliberatly slows traffic to and from the landing station in Melkboss. i.e. when entering or exiting their SAT3 cable.
Try a pingpath, and see for yourself.... its scary

I am not sure it it is deliberate, or accidental and that they just do not bother to fix it. :(

[spAc3dd]

I could tell you guys some interesting stories regarding how these bastards throw their weight around, but I don' think I wanna do it in writing as I might get sued. The problem is that, although their involvement in and practice of anticompetitive behaviour is glaringly obvious, nothing can be proved beyond a reasonable doubt as it would require someone at Telkom admitting to something. It's really easy to 'mysteriously' provide unexplainable problems on other companies networks when their networks run exclusively on your own infrastructure.

They have the whole country by the balls. All the consu,ersand all the companies. BUT WAIT...

There is NEOTEL, is there not? HA BLOODY HA. The Government has shares in them too! Until the government steps out of the arena and gives up their shares in the major telecom businesses, the consumer will ALWAYS lose, as it does not benefit the government to lower any tarriffs.

Just my 1 cents worth...

[gus]

Telecoms is just too much money for the government to step out.

[SosmanSA]

ahem.... guys ...won't get caught up with this thread. But let me say what I've said b4 on other threads... there is plenty competition out there to Telkom. Sentech, metro councils etc. who can do own carrier of carriers!! so use them and see who's actually worse and stick with your preference.

I won't go down the whole IS thingy either cause there's too much history there ... but there are two sides to every coin spAc3dd. (maybe over beer one day).

Later guys... GL with the ADSL gaming service.

[Tyrin]

But in the end everything & i mean everything gets routed via SAIX which in turn is owned by telkom. Every single ISP & telecom service has use SAIX. Even cell phones are routed through there. Proven Fact! Perhaps i should just bomb the headquaters! buggers! they control the market so it doesn't really matter who you choose!

[gus]

ahem.... guys ...won't get caught up with this thread. But let me say what I've said b4 on other threads... there is plenty competition out there to Telkom. Sentech, metro councils etc. who can do own carrier of carriers!! so use them and see who's actually worse and stick with your preference.


We know Telkom provides the best Internet service at the moment.

[stoke]

Gotta agree about the 2 sides to every coin, well .. 3 actually, and IS ... eish!

[doobiwan]

Maybe a silly question here, but do/can IS not have their own backbone linking major centres - then you'll only need the international access through telkom - or would that then fall into the telco operator realm .. ??

IS does have their own national network, that's why you can get IS based 30GB local only caps for R99. It may not be physically their cable but the effect is the same.

[Tyrin]

so they rent the cable network from telkom?