Travian alliance - way forward

[gus]

Based on this thread:
http://www.wargeeks.org/showthread.php?t=4421

I have not played travian before, so I am just guessing here, but it seems to me the game is soon going to move into the next phase, namely all out war to see who will get the wonder built first and win the game.

So, while it is fun at the moment to build up our little villages, soon we are maybe going to get trampled on, since we are too spread out to mount an effective attack or defense. For example, it will take me 38 hours to send some troops to Stoke. Then if somebody else gets attacked, I do not know for sure but I suspect it will take me 38 hours to recall my troops and then the same again to send them to that person, making it the best part of a week for a single troop movement.

So, while I like playing with the geeks, the endgame may just be too frustrating to be fun, with us so spread out. It might be more fun for us all to join local alliances for the final battle, to have troops fighting instead of just traveling.

Thoughts? What should we do?

Note, PJS also asked me by when will we have decided what we want to do.

[stoke]

I don't think any one of us can afford a "defense" army. It's just a waste of money, and those with armies must be using them to raid. I am more than willing to be a "feeder".

Well lets see, here is our options from my viewpoint:

1 - we should all join a strong alliance and quit WrG in order to be successful otherwise we will be wiped out if we carry on as is, but the existing alliances are location based, and we're all spread allover the place, so finding one alliance for us all is damn difficult.

2 - we should give up working together and move to our own little world where we can then be one of the "strong boys" and stand a chance of being around in the end-game, but in the end, that alliance's strong peeps will have victory, not us.

3 - we must elect our strong-points and feed them whatever they need to become super strong in order to stand a chance, while still remaining within the 24 hour feeding rules, and using the crannies to keep ourselves defended. I.e. Our strong points will have armies, the feeders will not, as in not ever.

PM's to : gkm; JAWS_Firefox ; noodle ; Scooby_Doo16 ; TheSaintMg ; star; Titan ; stool; veer477; Albereth ; Lycanking ; punky3025; onyx ; Askari-za ; sirfortie ; GeroW4lll ; sowaroc ; Darnit696 ; SlappY ;

[Lynus]

I would have to go for number 3

[gus]

I have a big alliance around me (rank 15):
http://s6.travian.com/allianz.php?aid=565

In the long run, I suspect for me it is a case of either joining them, or investing in some serious :lube:. They have asked if I wanted to join. I suspect they will take other big SW, aka -/-, players as well. Same way I think AFO will take on the -/+ people like Stoke etc.

I kind of feel it is unfair to expect some people to just supply resources and miss out on a big part of the game, so I am not very pro option 3.

[Punky3025]

I am just enjoying building my village. I will help where I can. If I get wiped out well.....tough.

[Onyx]

What Punky said.

I like being part of our alliance and wouldn't really want to break away from it. So, I guess its option 3 for me (whatever that means :o)

I haven't really had the time to sit and study this game too intensely - but like Punky said, I can help and supply resources where I can.

[Askari]

I don't see how other alliances don't suffer from the same problem we do, ie: being plonked randomly on the map. How do they get all close to each other or are the alliances just strangers who all decided to form an alliance cos they were all in the same area?

I havent been asked to join another alliance so for now its a mute point. I am right next door to Sainty so if we do join other alliances I imagine we will try to stick together.

At the moment I have no ideas.

[stoke]

You can choose where to setup camp when you join the server.
Anyways, all indications are that we're going to lose Gus, that's tough.
The question is though: will Gus take star with him?

In the meantime, I will be making alternating donations to :
Firefox_SA : 146
Scooby : 144
Noodle : 143
SaintMG : 131

Saint is pretty damn impressive. How on earth did he raise up so fast .. damn warmonger :p

[Askari]

I thought you could only choose a quadrant??

[stoke]

You can type in the exact location as well.
P.S. Don't try it on the same server, they punish you for having 2 open accounts.

[Askari]

FFS, i looked for that option when Caro joined but couldnt see it. Damn. Why did we all end up so split up then?

[stoke]

Cos i did not realise what a beeg difference it makes.
Anyways .. this is kind of like reality ... i mean, in seal life you and sainty are neighbours right :p

[Askari]

Is there any merit in us starting over on another world and doing it properly? We can still play server 6 as we are and see what happens.

I dont think it would be a significant extra burden as far as time goes as you could be doing stuff in two windows at the same time.

Just a thought.

[Stool]

if u guys are a bit impatient you are welcome to come join me on

speed.travian.com

its travian as you know it but 3 times faster

i'm in an alliance but got no problems leaving, they all a lil too paranoid for relaxed old me.

coords is -6 77

[Askari]

I was considering that but that speed would mean more time to administer the game. We are not all students you know :p

[Askari]

Also its not a matter of impatience, its just sheer time and distances between members of the alliance that make emergencies a problem.

[gus]

You can choose where to setup camp when you join the server.
Anyways, all indications are that we're going to lose Gus, that's tough.
The question is though: will Gus take star with him?

Saint is pretty damn impressive. How on earth did he raise up so fast .. damn warmonger :p

I do not want to leave. But as Askari says, we are too spread out to be effective at handling anything. I think we will have to write this one off as a purple heart (learning) experience and make sure we all start close together for the next round.

And if I leave, which I really do not want to do, I would hope all the -/- people would come along. Otherwise I do not really see the point. I would like to have a fighting chance for the endgame. As effectively a solo player at the moment, I am just going to be catapulted out to reduce risk.

Anybody know how long these servers last? Is there still going to be enough time to build up on the speed server. Or is another server maybe starting soon?

And how does one set exact coordinates when creating a village?

[gus]

I also did a quick investigation. As far as I can discover:

1) If the founding member (Stoke) leaves the alliance, the alliance carries on as normal. Stoke just needs to grant all his rights to somebody else as well, before he leave, otherwise the alliance is paralyzed.

2) The size of an alliance is governed by the size of the biggest embassy anywhere in the alliance. So, if Stoke leave, WrG cannot add new members until somebody else in the alliance has built a big enough embassy. Embassy size is only checked when somebody tries to join, so the alliance can remain indefinitely at its current size, it just cannot grow. It does not have to be the new leader that has the new embassy, any member can provide it. Also, if Stoke joins an alliance with say only a level 5 embassy, that alliance will then have the benefit of his bigger embassy and will be able to immediately grow to 24 members, without Stoke having to have any specific position in the new alliance.

[SlappY]

I reckon first thing is first, we need a comprehensive map of the land pertaining to our alliance. I reckon each person send me their coordinates along with the people in their direct vicinity and their names etc, I can plot it and redistribute. From there we can workout the most effective "groups" in our alliance. From there we could say, Mr. X, Y and Z, attack Mr. A, etc.

[stoke]

Table moved to : http://wargeeks.org/showthread.php?p=75226

[SlappY]

K, great. Now we need each person to plot the villages in their vicinity and population.

[stoke]

Re-sorted the table by location. Easy peasy.
Adding the missing peeps and the populations.
Complete, so now we knows who our neighbours are. Now what?

[Onyx]

:cry:

I live the furtherererestest away from everyone.

[gus]

Anyways, all indications are that we're going to lose Gus, that's tough.
The question is though: will Gus take star with him?


Note, I am in no rush to go anywhere. I was just trying to say if the -/+ people go somewhere to avoid a :lube: situation, I might have a new home of the bigger -/- peeps as well. And that at some stage the sim city vs war thing might force our hand, as I am beginning to understand the game.

[Sowaroc]

I know I've not been here for the brunt of this conversation, but I'll put my two cents in now. I do like the 3rd idea although it is somewhat implausible. If we did go with this (I think we should; I like challenges), we will need people with supersized crannies (been stated already) and a few with massive armies (also stated previously).

The smaller people who collect mostly resources will also need a decent sized (meaning just enough for protection) army and strong wall to prevent full scale invasion.

Also, maybe we should think about joining one quadrant next round.

[JAWS_Firefox]

I think Travian s6 should be our school and hopefully s7 is not too far off. Not only can we then try and be closer, but I, for one, would definitely start the game with different initial objectives.

As far as the gobbling up of smaller alliances are concerned, I think non-allied players will go first. Then the small (2-5 member) alliances. By watching the numbers, we might have ample warning before the Pacmen get to our sized alliances.

Is our geographic seperation a problem, other than logistically for ourselves? At the moment we seem strong with 24-odd members. And only a close investigation by an enemy, of each member of our alliance, will reveal our Achilles Heel. Now, I'm not gonna go to all that trouble and I don't think many ppl would. Bottom line is, the numbers work for us. I was aattacked 3-5 times a day b4 I joined...now it's maybe once a week. And yet I am vulnerable because I'm damn far from all of you (besides Fage). But no-one in my neck of the woods has seen that.

So, if we have to change the status quo, my vote is for opt 3.

[Star]

Nope, I'm not joining gus's new alliance. But I want to propose antoher option. Why dont we subdevide into regional alliances - informally. That way we can band together and effectively help one another. When the end game comes we still play as an alliance.

[stoke]

Definitely, get to know yer neighbors, as pointed out in this thread: http://wargeeks.org/showthread.php?t=4427

[Darnit696]

I was in that list twice. under-/+ and under -/- ... duly edited :)

Currently I opt for option 3

[Titan]

who in my area is making the troops?...I will sent resources just let me have co-ords...

[stoke]

We need to grow the alliance, I will have 2 spaces available either tonight or tomorrow. Please post your invite nominations here: http://wargeeks.org/showthread.php?p=75296#post75296

[veer477]

I've got a decently strong alliance surrounding me. Soulscar. Last time I looked they ranked 15th. They have been attacking me everyday so I'm not building anymore troops until i'm bigger. I also think we should just use this as training.

[JAWS_Firefox]

Nope, I'm not joining gus's new alliance. But I want to propose antoher option. Why dont we subdevide into regional alliances - informally. That way we can band together and effectively help one another. When the end game comes we still play as an alliance.

Have no problem with this option, especially once we start running into embassy size constraints or exorbitant embassy upgrading costs.

However, not sure if regional division will be optimum. I am in the SE region, but close to the border with SW. There is quite a few ppl in the SW region that are close to the SE border. Maybe, once everyone is plotted on Slappy's map, we should divvy up according to who's close, irrespective of region.

But again, unless someone actually plots all our members' location and analyse that we are spread out, we will seem strong to most players.

And in line with that, Stokie, you've indicated that a say-nothing description of the clan seems more menacing. But how about at least adding our alliances with other alliances? Can only increase our "scare-factor:rofl:"

[Roloreaper]

"Scare factor..." Just the Label War Geek instills fear in every village....
Secondly we will see what we can do I need to be a resource whore so I'm going full to the Creating Resources.... and a small raiding army just to speed up the Farming prospect!

I have a good start village now i need to get the farms all going!

[stoke]

Splitting up does not add any distinct advantage, except for trying to get new embers into the alliance by saying: "We are in the same quadrant".

The increasing cost of the embassy is a factor, but at least it's only one point that needs to be defended from catapults when we hit that stage and if we still want to get more members. If we don't want to grow anymore once the catapults start rolling, well then who cares if our embassy in my village is eradicated.

I do think we should get to know our neighbors, but splitting up is a bit daft, unless the future plan of a split is to join another alliance that is already controlling that quadrant.

Also, when you do join another alliance, what's the chances of the alliance using you and then spitting you out later?

[gus]

One can see our spread nicely using this website:
http://travianmap.nl/index.php?ln=en#
Just select s6.travian.com and type |WrG| in the alliance box.

We do have a fair number of border cases.

I cannot really speak for Star, but from what I understand she does not mean physically split the alliance, just to form "work groups" in the alliance. Big total alliance size is good for us as well.

[stoke]

Oh wow ... from that picture, we're all in the CENTRE QUADRANT'S.
Damn, we are so well organised, and did not even know it :)
But then again, I spoze all the players are.
http://www.wargeeks.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=937&stc=1&d=1196679866

[Darnit696]

Awesome link Gus. :sharp:

[gus]

Oh wow ... from that picture, we're all in the CENTRE QUADRANT'S.
Damn, we are so well organised, and did not even know it :)
But then again, I spoze all the players are.


I think only the area with a radius of about 185 from the center is currently being used. :D

[craime]

hello guys im a noob but joining in.
sounds like fun if we can get sth organised going really quickly.
and it seems most of us prefer to stick together in this alliance, even though we know we would probably get smashed quicker than others as we are spread into little colonies on the map.. but hell it should be fun isnt.

but im still a total noob so i dunno the actual strategy when it comes to end game like u guys were talking abt.. im just a happy sim city builder now hehe

[Roloreaper]

Craimne... maybe we can TK you soon in BF2... Then you'll learn faster :)
Or Stokie will come and TeeBag you.... after i TK you... 10 or so time... and I promise you I'm the man that can do that to his team! :)

[craime]

haha unfortunately my lappy cant support BF2.. perhaps next time :P (im a big fan of SC btw, waitin for SC2)

[stoke]

I heard somebody say Teabaggin ... :drool:

[gus]

Yes, really hope SC2 is at least half as good as all the hype says.

[Roloreaper]

haha unfortunately my lappy cant support BF2.. perhaps next time :P (im a big fan of SC btw, waitin for SC2)

But I can't go a Tee Bag you in StarCraft..... :( But yes I'm big on the releasing of SC2 as well!


I think the Geeks can grow closer by adding villages between our distant neighbors... It can then free up our caravans to transport other help as well as staging platforms for troop movements!

[stoke]

Hey peeps, it's only me and Saint that that have managed to entice other people (that we don't know from a bar of soap) to join the alliance. We gots 2 empty spaces, and that will be 5 empty spaces by the weekend .. COMON!

[gus]

Yes, I plan to put my next village next to another geeks. I am currently looking at the Saint cluster, since that is where we have the most people already.

[Roloreaper]

Brilliant... I'll try get Mine between Onx and that cluster! Oneday when I can do that! :)

[SintaxErr]

I've just started, i'm at X148 y98.. I'm near Onyx, but the rest of you are like 30 + hours away..

[stoke]

You get 2.5 days to research resources like crazy.
i.e. For the first 3 days you cannot be attacked.
Then for the rest of day 2.5, create and build your cranny up to cover your resources + 1/3.

Then get back into researching resources.
Resources Resources Resources Cranny Resources Resources Resources Cranny Resources ..
If you have something spare, build an embassy and join the alliance.
The other useful building is a marketplace for sending resources around.

DO NOT FEED THE MONSTERS.
If you have more resources than your (cranny - 1/3) can hide, tell us so that we can help you get the cranny up to spec, or let you send your spare resources to us (you need a marketplace for this)

Welcome to the slowest game in the world.

[gus]

I have sent you an alliance invite. When you have your embassy built, you can accept the invite there.

[SintaxErr]

Finally! a game i can keep up with... :rofl:
Thanks for the advice. I'll make sure to build up the cranny.

[craime]

Yes, I plan to put my next village next to another geeks. I am currently looking at the Saint cluster, since that is where we have the most people already.

yeah its the most crowded wrg spot ever. cant even farm with saint and askari lurking and farming ard all the time :p hehe but i got my fair share.

[Askari]

We are cleaning out our sector.

[SaintMg]

yeah Scary and i have decided to take out all the peeps near us giving us a min 1hour buffer..

there are not too many peeps to our south and will probly just use them up too :D

[Askari]

We are very aggressive arent we Sainty?

[Roloreaper]

Well if you guys can maybe take over a little town it might beat trying to upgrade one :(

[gus]

Cannot take over capital villages. Can just catapult them to a zero population, effectively taking the person out of the game for a while they need to build up again.

[Roloreaper]

ok Thats swak.... What protects you from catpults .... cause I want that :)

[gus]

Lots of troops. Also, if the attack is from very far, if other alliance members are closer to the attacker and can catapult his granary and farms, some of the catapults may starve before they arrive at your place.

Somebody that wants to catapult you is very likely to send multiple waves of troops. The purpose of the first wave (cleaners) is to kill your defending troops. The second wave then has additional troops and the catapults to damage your village. That way the catapults are relatively safe, as long as the first wave can clean the village.

A counter tactic for the multiple waves is to remove all your troops from the village when the first wave arrives and then have them all back for the second wave, resulting in a slaughter of the catapults. However that is impossible if the wave are only seconds or minutes apart. Also, there may be false waves containing say only one troop each, making it impossible to know which wave contains the catapults.

[Titan]

@Gus,

Damn....u r one clued up Dude :bow:...rep for that m8 ;)

[gus]

Thanks, wish I could take the credit, but I read it here:
http://help.travian.com/index.php?type=faq&mod=528
http://help.travian.com/index.php?type=faq&mod=564